From Vox.

What does it mean to be “woke”? It’s become a catch-all term to smear or dismiss anything that has any vague association with progressive politics. So anytime you venture into an argument about “wokeness,” it becomes hopelessly entangled in a broader cultural battle.

Subscribe to our channel! http://goo.gl/0bsAjO

Today’s guest, journalist and professor Musa al-Gharbi, helps us untangle “wokeness” from its fraught political context. The author of the book, We Have Never Been Woke: The Cultural Contradictions of a New Elite, al-Gharbi discusses what effects the movement is and isn’t having on our society.

This episode originally aired in November 2024.

Host: Sean Illing (@seanilling)
Guest: Musa al-Gharbi (@Musa_alGharbi)

6:11 What is wokeness?
18:48 Why George Floyd only mattered to the public after his death
20:32 How elites navigate the tension between their status and their values
28:43 How culturally significant is “wokeness”?
32:21 Do social movements produce change?
42:22 Will our politics remain polarized?

We would love to hear from you. To tell us what you thought of this episode, email us at thegrayarea@vox.com or leave us a voicemail at 1-800-214-5749. Your comments and questions help us make a better show.

And you can watch new episodes of The Gray Area on YouTube. New episodes drop every Monday and Friday.

Listen to The Gray Area ad-free by becoming a Vox Member: vox.com/members. Vox.com is a news website that helps you cut through the noise and understand what’s really driving the events in the headlines. Check out http://www.vox.com.

Watch our full video catalog: http://goo.gl/IZONyE
Follow Vox on Facebook: http://goo.gl/U2g06o
Or Twitter: http://goo.gl/XFrZ5H